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Saxon Advanced Math?

Saxon Advanced Math?

Is Saxon Advanced Math a one year course or meant to be done over two years?

I have seen it mentioned both ways, and I am trying to make a tentative plan for 8th - 12th.

Thanks!

re: Saxon Advanced Math?

Apparently there isn't a fixed correct answer. read on.

Many "by the book" Saxon users will say this is a 3 or 4 semester book and plan for 4 semesters. Advocates of this route tend to have been using Saxon "as written" (do every problem every time, do not add another text to do a full year proof based geometry). They will say 4 semesters to cover it. One expert out there says the way to do that is simply to take 2 days to do each lesson. Do the odds on one day, evens on the next. The rationale is that a lot of information is covered and you want to go at a slower pace through the book. Another point often made it is that this helps you to have a plan for grade 10 and 11 for most students on saxon path.

The two years get 2 math credits with titles that can be searched for out there.

My cover school suggests for those doing Saxon that way it goes like this:
using Advanced Mathematics, 2nd Ed (Part 1).
Course title “Geometry with Advanced Algebra” (1 credit) after they have completed lessons 1 – 60.

and the next year Advanced mathematics, 2nd Ed (Part 2).
Course title “Trigonometry w/Pre-Calculus” (1 Credit) after they have completed lessons 61 – 125

I have also heard of an expert who has suggestion that it's a little different and the student does a lather rinse repeat style. I don't have a link. maybe someone else will.

HOWEVER!

Other Saxon users (me for example) used Saxon with other "experts". So, both my oldest and middle gal simply did Advanced in one academic year. And this was fine.

We typically would do math 5 days a week. One lesson (or one test depending on the day) per day. and the pace was fine for both a math is easy academic nerd, and for a slow to average math is what it is kind of student. The year she did Advanced my "nerd" was in grade 11. My slow to average was 12th grade. The "expert" path maker we used was mfw's lesson plans and math path where we do a year of proof based geometry (Jacobs to be exact) between Saxon alg 1 and alg 2 before going to the Advanced. In their lesson plans they give a way to do this book in 3 semesters (3 math lessons a week instead of 5 with properly selected problem sets) and suggest that some students may need 4 semesters. They even said some might do this in 2 semesters.

both of mine did it in 2 semesters. math would take 90 minutes or so a day with "slow to average" middle child. 5 days a week. one lesson a day using the mfw plans.

and I'll add (but I know the OP knows this), my oldest did fine with this in college and she's a triple STEM major including one of those majors in math. other kid is a creative arts future.

This post was edited on Jun 18, 2017 06:33 AM

re: Saxon Advanced Math?

My oldest 2 dc are getting ready to start Advanced Math in July sometime. We are planning on spreading it out over 2 years per Art Reed's recommendations by doing odds one day and evens the next. My will-be 10th grader is fine with this plan, as she is not interested in a STEM career. My will-be 9th grader is asking if he can do the whole book in one year, since he might dual enroll starting in 10th. He wants to be an engineer, so he'll need lots of math in college. I haven't decided whether to let him pick up the pace on math or not; he's already ahead of where he needs to be, and he'll have plenty of other courses (including 2 sciences) to keep him busy. We'll see!

re: Saxon Advanced Math?

cbollin,
When your kids did it in 1 year-5 day/week did you give the 2 credits you spelled out for the 2 year-2 day/week plan (Adv. Alg/Geom and Trig/PreCalc)?

re: Saxon Advanced Math?

cbollin,
When your kids did it in 1 year-5 day/week did you give the 2 credits you spelled out for the 2 year-2 day/week plan (Adv. Alg/Geom and Trig/PreCalc)?
****

I choose to give just 1 credit for Advanced.

my rationale: Since we had done Jacobs Geometry, I considered the geometry in Advanced (combined with the geometry in Alg 2) to be review material and not another full course. And for reasons, I didn't want to call it a Trig/Pre Calc course either. **

I guess I didn't think we had done 2 courses in one.

I can remember last fall telling my middle student if she wanted to stop at the end of lesson 60 and call it a year. (showed her she could) and she didn't want to do that.

Different people do what works for their homeschool. I'm wasn't doing Saxon as written and blessed by reed, so I adjusted.


**on the trig thing? long story. several real life people whose children went into engineering told me their students had to take a Trig refresher course at their top notch engineering school in order to be successful in Calc 2 after having done Saxon Adv. So we did a College Trig semester as part of grade 12 and semester of intro to calc (but not using Saxon) for oldest since she's in that field. Other people may not experience that issue. and who knows? maybe my oldest didn't need it either. (but she is rocking the A in her math major (along with EE and CS) going into final year of college.

re: Saxon Advanced Math?

OK, thx!
I will have to figure out how to handle that.
My son is going into 10th and we got behind in math (my fault) b/c, hey, it's fine, he isn't a STEM kid. Well, guess what? Now he is considering engineering. SOOOOOO....

He needs Alg 1, 2, Geometry, PreCal/Trig, Calculus in 3 years. Thank goodness the Geometry is mixed in with the Saxon Algebra. It might not be top notch geometry from what I have read but I don't care. It'll get done.

So we are going to use summers and try to squeeze all of that in before he graduates and if not then the summer after he graduates or at a local CC if he does a gap year before college.

re: Saxon Advanced Math?

This discussion is very helpful.

cbollin, I read your first post yesterday and it did help clarify the Advanced Saxon Math book and how different people use it and how many semesters MFW uses it for (I was trying to figure that out on their web-site and wasn't able to). I was assuming it was a one year book until I read, a week ago, that many spread it out over two years. Congratulations, BTW, to your dd's success in math in college! Way to go mom!

The further discussion on Trig versus Calculus versus Geometry is helping me start to think through the books and topics; it also leads to a few questions.

What do you think of the Geometry coverage in Saxon Algebra II and Advanced Math cbollin? The first time I ever read of Saxon math the author was indicating its Geometry was complete (WTM book). I have since read that it is incomplete. After teaching those books twice what do you think? My son really likes graphing and Geometry so I was thinking adding a full Geometry book makes sense for him.

What do you think of the Pre-Calculus coverage, topic wise, in Advanced Math? Does it work, or is it trying to cover too much by including the Geometry and thus falling short some on the Pre-Calculus (it sounds like it might be?)?

I have three tentative plans that I need to still work through by looking more into the Algebra I books themselves to compare two of them:

Saxon Algebra I
Geometry with Stines or Jacobs
Saxon Algebra II
Saxon Advanced Math
? ~ depends on where he is at when we reach 17/18.

Foerster's Algebra I
Geometry by Stein or Jacobs
Foerster's Algebra II
Foerster's Pre-Calculus / Trig
? ~ depends on goals and where he is at when we reach 17/18

Saxon Algebra I
Geometry with Stines or Jacobs
Saxon Algebra II
Foerster's Pre-Calculus / Trig
? ~ depends on goals and where he is at when we reach 17/18

At age 13 I would say he could go a possible 5 different directions, and math could be a possible necessity for at least one or two of them. At this point I am wanting to keep possible doors open.

re: Saxon Advanced Math?

He needs Alg 1, 2, Geometry, PreCal/Trig, Calculus in 3 years. Thank goodness the Geometry is mixed in with the Saxon Algebra. It might not be top notch geometry from what I have read but I don't care. It'll get done.

So we are going to use summers and try to squeeze all of that in before he graduates and if not then the summer after he graduates or at a local CC if he does a gap year before college.
****

Respectfully suggesting other ideas for you to consider:

You do NOT have to have done calculus in high school in order to be college ready for Calculus 1 as an engineering student. If you need Alg 1, 2, Geometry and PreCalc in 3 years, and are already considering Saxon, just go with Saxon Alg 1, 2, Advanced and be encouraged to call it the classes on the transcript that many Saxon fans have used for years to call it a total of 4 credits.

A dear friend of mine's son only got through Saxon Advanced by end of grade 12 and was placed into his engineering Calculus 1. The school did have him take a "trig" class to fill in the gaps in order to be ready for Calc 2 as an engineering student. That trig class was about 9 weeks in length and taken as a tutorial at the same time as Calc 1. It was a normal path for many of the freshman to do that. And this was at one of the really top notch engineering universities in his state (and country as well).

My oldest did get exposure to Calculus while in high school, but overall we felt it wiser to not push for early credit or advanced placement into Calc 2. She took Calc 1 as first semester freshman just like the rest of the engineers. Yes, it was easy, but useful as she could step up to college classes and all of that.

With that said, some people will say you need Calc in high school to have it more competitive of an application but they tend to be talking about $$$$$$$ top name places. However, my kiddo was admitted early in senior year before Calc was on the transcript and she got her scholarships on other stuff. Maybe it's not the same in all places.

Do not rush to get to Calculus. Make sure the algebra is strong foundation and understand.

:)

and that's how I see it :)

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